Athletics owner John Fisher says he has now spent $300 million on a new Las Vegas stadium, and construction on the upper deck is set to begin soon on the $2 billion project. Next up, he can tap both a $300 million private construction loan from Goldman Sachs and $380 million in public bonds, which will get him to around $1 billion, with about another billion to go.
Is this a sign that Fisher is prepared to spend whatever it takes of his own family fortune — probably around $3 billion, mostly in Gap stock, I tried to find an updated figure but couldn’t get past this awesome AI-generated article that describes him as “one of the prominent figures behind the San Francisco Giants” — to get a stadium built in Vegas? Or that he’s still hoping to build enough momentum to lure in new investors — so far he’s pre-sold concessions rights and a minority share of the team to Aramark for $175 million and reportedly has another $70 million coming from a Korean investment fund, plus there’s whatever he can scrape together from “limited” seat license fees — in hopes of not having to raid his family’s savings?
Either remains possible, and either would betray a certain stupidity on Fisher’s part. There’s almost no way the A’s owner can hope to earn back $1.6 billion in personal outlay (more like $1.4 billion after additional tax breaks, but still) just from the proceeds of running an MLB team in the league’s smallest market; it’s possible he’s hoping the Vegas move will increase the value of the team, but even if you start with the team’s pre-move estimated value of $1.2 billion, the A’s would have to become worth as much as the Los Angeles Angels for Fisher just to break even, and that ain’t happening. On the other hand, if he’s hoping to fob the cost off on investors, that would come at the expense of diluting his share of the team and dedicating future stadium revenue streams to repay his new partners, which again will almost certainly leave Fisher in the red.
That said, it’s a billionaire’s prerogative to spend their money on really stupid shit, so just because it’s a dumb idea doesn’t mean Fisher isn’t prepared to do it. It’s unlikely his fellow MLB owners are going to step in — they just voted Fisher onto their executive committee, so they’re not preparing to push him out — and if his family members are planning to pull the plug once his spending hits a certain point, they’ve been really good at remaining mum. While I have zero inside information, at this point I’m tentatively ready to shift my bet from “John Fisher will never move the A’s to Las Vegas” to “John Fisher will eventually move the A’s the Las Vegas and it’ll be a beautiful train wreck,” though I’d still prefer if you gave me favorable odds.
Is John Fisher the Max Bialystock of MLB owners?
When the inevitable cost overruns start to hit, who pays? Do they slash the amenities?
Bring your own beer cup to the game?
He should have moved the team to Portland, Or. They’re craving baseball there and they have the land & money. My Mariners needs an I-5 rivalry!
Vegas (please change the name from A’s) will probably having people sitting in the stadium with free tickets from the hotels on the strip.
Vegas sells out all their sports and Baseball will be no different. I dont understand why people think sports teams will fail in that City when both the Raiders and knights have proven differently year after year. The announcement for an NBA team is coming this year
@ Wild Bill:
The Knights were first – first teams into markets usually develop instant loyalty even if the market isn’t a traditional one for the sport. That’s only compounded with their instant success and bringing Vegas their first professional championship.
The NFL is the king of American sports and the Raiders, however bad they’ve been for most of the last 20+ years, are one of the top brands.
The NBA will do fine, among other reasons being that the supply will be 18,000ish tickets for 41 home games.
Fisher is, supposedly, moving a laughingstock of a franchise to the area a decade after the Knights and Raiders set up shop. Given the small market, it’s already on the verge of being oversaturated with professional sports and that’s not even taking into account the thousand other entertainment options that exist. And tourism won’t be enough to carry them – tourism works for the Raiders because it’s one game a week, usually on a Sunday. That’s a lot more ideal to plan a trip around than counting on hundreds or thousands of Twins fans to make an A’s series in the middle of a week.
Been a lot written about Fisher having “spent” $300m and committed $1bn to project spending already.
Frankly, looking at the construction cam footage I don’t see $300m worth of work already done. That said, it is certainly possible he’s counting what is already ‘committed’ as part of the $300m… which would mean he has spent around $100m so far and is committed to reaching the trigger point for the $680m in other people’s money.
That part I can certainly believe. There is no downside to passing that spending level – particularly if he has already spent the $175m from Aramark and the money coming from the KIF as part of “his” $300m.
Vis the PSLs… could he sell 6-8,000 at an avg of $10k each? My bet would be no, but it is possible he could raise another $50m or so from PSLs I would think. Not sure who would be buying them, but it only takes a couple of thousand really rich people who want special seats to get to $50m.
So what happens after he spends his (somewhere between $100m and) $300m and the $680m in taxpayer money?
Playing devil’s advocate, let’s say he just stops once he has spent the money… so no roof, no AC, no armadillo on the skyline.
Certainly he would be in violation of his agreements with all the regulatory agencies/municipal and state govts and MLB.
But does anyone think they will refuse to accept a late design change on a new stadium in Vegas?
Would MLB force him to stay in Sacramento? Don’t think so. In fact, he could offer that as an option when notifying MLB that the stadium is already “finished”… knowing they will not take him up on it.
Would the city/county attempt to padlock the facility until it is ‘finished’ (knowing it is as finished as it is going to get)? Doubtful. Is having no activity and no tax revenue from the partially finished stadium somehow better than receiving “less” than expected?
How would not fully completing the stadium be any different than never completing the surrounding ‘public benefit’ development in any other sports facility funding scam?
I’m not saying this is what he will do… but if he did, I doubt any of the involved/interested parties would do anything other than hold their noses and agree. Some might sue. But to what end?
If this all ends with Clark County parking a tractor on home plate, it will have been worth all of the pain and suffering thus far.
Hopefully the tractor will have a cab and air conditioning.
The number of stalled Vegas projects this century are numerous. The fountainbleu sat partially completed for nearly 15 years.
Fisher is using up whatever money the GLPI and Ballys have committed plus some of his own cash in hopes of luring a big ole dummy who wants in on the action to help him complete it. The financing is not in place because they haven’t found that sucker yet. Unlike the large scale casino projects that just sat empty- Fisher has 2 entities that could bail him out, MLB and/or the state of Nevada.
Maybe in next years legislative session he gets a new deal for the stadium- maybe it’s not even more cash but these tax credits that Fisher can then use to sweeten the deal for a potential buyer. You know who pays a lot of taxes in the state of Nevada- gaming companies- is it ridiculous to think that Fisher takes his current tax credits plus another $200 million he forces through the legislature to sweeten the pot for a company like MGM or Caesers to buy a hefty share of the team?
I would think they’d be too smart for that, but maybe the numbers make sense?
Given the backlash that’s building against widespread gambling permeating every aspect of American culture, MLB would have to be fools to let a casino company onto the cap table of one of their teams, let alone the one that’s become the poster child for the league’s decline. That’s not to say it won’t happen…
Millions from one investor, millions from another. Sounds like the start of a Ponzi scheme. How do I get in on the ground floor and who will lend me the money?
The Aramark money isn’t Ponzi-ish — they’re getting concessions rights plus an equity stake in the team. So it’s mostly just pre-paying for a contract that Fisher would otherwise get to pocket the money from.
As for the Korean investors, it’s $70m for 2-3% of the team, which values the whole franchise at $2.3B to $3.5B, which sounds like an awful investment, but it’s their money. We don’t have all that much on the details of the deal, but if they’re getting some kind of ad boards or naming rights or something in addition, then it might again just be pre-paying on something the A’s could normally sell and keep the revenue from.
Basically, Fisher can either invest a ton of his family money and hope he’ll turn a profit, or he can sell off future revenue streams now and hope he’ll turn a profit down the road without them. Neither seems like a great bet, but again, nobody said you have to be smart to inherit a pile of money
They must think Vegas tourism will come back from the dead, and they can sell the tickets at tourist markup prices.
If Fisher is hoping the move increases the value of the A’s, it’d be a long play. I think one of the conditions of the move being approved is he faces a penalty if he sells the team in the first 10 years after the move.
Also, I’ve read that one of the conditions for accessing the public money from Nevada is that a GMP needs to be set with the GC, which I haven’t seen reported yet, though maybe that domino will fall soon.
It’s a penalty of 20% of the sale price starting in 2028, reducing to 0% in 2034. So not that long a play.
I think his game is to sell the team. I suspect he personally takes less of a tax hit if he sells a NV team than he would selling a CA team. I think he recently bought a home in NV which I assume is to establish residency.
Were you aware that many large similar projects are funded to a large degree by an SBLOC? I understand people who don’t understand financing options write about this in brief posts on X or FB, but an entire article missing the point?
To use an SBLOC, he needs to have a way to pay off the securities-backed loan with new revenue. So he’s right back in the same predicament of trying to figure out how to generate $1.4B in value from a stadium in a small market.
I can raise money without selling my house by taking out a HELOC, but I’m still eating into my equity. Same goes for an SBLOC.
With all due respect, you clearly don’t understand the Vegas market.
The Vegas market lets you borrow against equity without it showing up on your balance sheet? No wonder people like visiting there so much!
But this market will be different!
Comedian Robert Klein on line two….
Sounds like maybe you have some real estate in Las Vegas we can invest in? I understand if you’re reticent to get into details on a public forum, of course expert dealers with the inside track prefer to keep things behind closed doors.
This was a delightful rhetorical gambit.
“Sir, you are drunk and pantsless.”
“With all due respect, you clearly don’t understand the Vegas market.”
I have said before that the A’s will end up in Vegas by hook or by crook. The commissioner was hellbent on taking the A’s out of Oakland and is committed to getting the team to Vegas eventually. Manfred is definitely a jerk, but he is probably not foolish enough to go out on a limb without the backing of the other MLB owners.
If necessary to get the ballpark completed, MLB will either loan Fisher the money to get it done, or help him sell the team to an ownership group with the capital and wherewithal to get it done.
It’s not about capital, though — if Fisher wants a loan, I’m sure he can get a loan. It’s about having the revenue to pay back the loan, and to do that they’d have to start raking in ticket and media revenue like the top third of MLB teams, which in the 41st largest TV market is just implausible, tourists or no.
Traditional media market ranks are less relevant with streaming, viewing area, etc. But on the topic of media market size, the rank of the Bay Area #10 is not accurate for baseball viewership as most in the market are Giants fans. Markets go by counties, and if the East Bay counties were their own market, they would be #36, not above Vegas but without the huge tourist advantage.
And while tourism is in a slight decline, experts predict it will turn around. The Raiders with Allegiant including non-sporting events have greatly exceeded revenue and economic benefit expectations. NBA will likely come and smart money with billionaires continues to invest heavily in resort expansion, updating, and new development. The ballpark is also in the sweet spot between smaller T-Mobile and larger Allegiant for many potential non-baseball events including the rodeo. And more visitors will likely come with the high speed train from SoCal.
So you can be as skeptical as you want, but those who know the area, have money and smarts think otherwise.
typo
the East Bay counties were their own market, they would be #36, not FAR above Vegas but without the huge tourist advantage.
But the east bay is much wealthier then Las Vegas. Vegas locals are poor and work non traditional hours, and have so many other live entertainment options . The gameday experience is going to have to be incredible and affordable, which doesn’t seem possible with the amount of money this ownership group seems planning on spending
Which is undoubtedly why we’re seeing so many locals with money rush to invest in this project.
I’m not saying it’s impossible for Fisher to succeed in a market that size. (It will help some, certainly, if Manfred succeeds in evening out the TV rights revenue some among teams.) I am saying that everyone I’ve spoken to with even slight expertise in sports business thinks that it’s a very, very bad bet, and I have no reason to dispute that.
I know of people interested in investing or have already invested, but financing is private. The only money that needs public disclosure is $100M along with a GMP. Team said they expect to access this later in the development cycle and Stadium Authority CEO said expected later in 2026.
You can listen to all the “everyones” in the world you want. The smart money who knows sports and Vegas says otherwise. BTW this is from Alan Hoffman
Alan Hoffman, a stadium financing expert and partner at law firm Winston & Strawn, has expressed high confidence in the success of Major League Baseball (MLB) in Las Vegas, particularly regarding the Oakland Athletics’ planned move to the Strip
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Hoffman’s analysis of the potential for baseball in Las Vegas includes the following points:
Ideal Market Conditions: Hoffman believes Las Vegas is an ideal market, telling the Las Vegas Review-Journal that the move “should be a huge hit” by drawing on a combination of strong tourism and a growing local, family-based community.
Unique Sponsorship Opportunities: Unlike cities with traditional corporate bases (like Oakland), Las Vegas offers unique, lucrative partnership deals with local casinos. Hoffman noted that these casinos are “wonderful partners” for sponsorships, working together to showcase both gaming and sports entertainment.
Superior Revenue Potential: Hoffman indicated that there is more money to be made on sponsorships in Las Vegas than in cities with traditional Fortune 500 companies.
Success of 30,000-Seat Model: He supports the plan for a smaller, 30,000-seat stadium, suggesting it fits the trend of focusing on a better, more intimate fan experience. He noted that revenue can be made through premium options, such as luxury boxes and high-end dining, rather than just capacity.
Comparison to Oakland: Hoffman highlighted that when compared to Oakland, Las Vegas provides far superior corporate sponsorship opportunities.
Hoffman has worked on large-scale stadium projects for major teams, including the Los Angeles Dodgers, New York Yankees, Dallas Cowboys, and Boston Celtics.
The “Everyones” I have listened to on this are the MLB Commissioner and the majority of the other MLB owners.
They approved the move, but described the entire enterprise as an “iffy” proposition.
Since they are in the business of running baseball teams (and leagues), I think they have a really good idea what is needed to be successful.
They approved the move because Fisher had backed himself into a corner (in fact, he didn’t even have a corner left… the city effectively evicted his team) in Oakland and had nowhere else to go. In addition, Vegas was a market the owner’s club didn’t see as viable for expansion, and it freed up a market (Oakland/Alameda county ~ just across the line from San Jose) for future expansion if desired.
As for your Hoffman related claims, I would very reluctant to accept at face value any information provided by a firm that does the kind of work W-S does for the Trump administration. In addition, while they do not have an office in LV so far as I know, they do have strong connections to the business lobby there and have sponsored SFVegas more than once.
They are hardly a disinterested/neutral party as regards sports promotion…
The Vegas average household income is low because of the number of service industry employees. But we ave some very affluent neighborhoods whose medium home sales prices blow away everything in the Bay, including Atherton. Also, many wealthy people are continuing to flee the Bay Area and California in general for Las Vegas.
“Medium” home sale price trivia, the low-level real estate hustler’s favorite conversation topic. Keep it up, pal, you’ll catch up with Donny T any day now.
There’s not a “sweet spot” for 30,000 seat venues when it comes to other events. Baseball stadiums are pretty bad venues for concerts and sports besides baseball. Allegiant as a concert venue seats about 40,000. The number of artists that could sell out a 25,000 seat configuration vs a 40,000 seat one is not a very long list. Outside of maybe the rodeo- an A’s stadium is just cannibalizing Allegiant.
Many who understand the Vegas market disagree. Popular venues and vendors are frequently booked 1–3 years in advance.
The high speed train from California is far from a done deal. Brightline hasn’t done any work in CA and on the brink of bankruptcy. It’s a shame as their Florida product is quite good.
Your comment has so much bias and spin it could have come out of the sleaziest Bay Area rag.
Your comment about owners considering Las Vegas as “iffy” only represented the concerns of a few large-market owners. The following points describe the MLB positions:
1) Unanimous Approval: The vote to move was swift and unanimous (30-0), signaling strong consensus that Las Vegas is a better long-term location than staying in Oakland.
2) Market Potential vs. Size: While some owners initially questioned the small size of the Las Vegas media market, the promise of a new stadium and a tourist-driven revenue model outweighed those concerns.
3)Long-Term Strategy: The move is seen as bringing MLB to a “global destination,” supported by both locals and visitors, potentially turning the city into a major sports hub similar to the success of the NFL’s Raiders despite obvious differences between the NFL and MLB.
Your statement that “Fisher had backed himself into a corner” is both biased and dishonest because it suggests the major fault for the team not securing a stadium deal in the Bay Area was John Fisher’s. The facts are the attempts over 20+ years failed because of the anti-business politicians, government inaction and red-tape, the Giants, environmental problems and red-tape, popular opposition to a stadium especially in Fremont, etc.
The only thing you said that had a modicum of truth was about the city effectively evicting the team. The city demanded conditions for the team to stay in Oakland for a few years that were so ridiculous that would never be accepted.
Your comment that Alan Hoffman’s opinions should be discounted because his firm had involvement with the Trump administration is both ridiculous and telling. Did you know another partner also had involvement with the Biden administration? Hoffman was involved with several major stadiums but Trump was a red flag for you. Whether you’re in the Bay Area or not, those Bay Area politics have screwed up the area and the state very well.
Given the slight improvement in grammar relative to your other comments, and the injection of a numbered list into the middle of this one, I strongly suspect I am responding to an AI-generated comment here. Let’s examine some points:
> only represented the concerns of a few large-market owners
Those few large-market owners make the bulk of the league’s revenue, and Fisher has ensured that the A’s have been a permanent revenue-sharing recipient throughout his tenure. Of course their concerns should be weighted more heavily. At least if we’re considering baseball as an operating business and not just a set of 30 passive-appreciation investment assets, like most of the existing owners do.
> The move is seen as bringing MLB to a “global destination,”
That idea was already suspicious and is now thoroughly gut-shot by lunatic Trump administration immigration policy. This was tacitly supported by such Las Vegas luminaries as Miriam Adelson, so you must forgive me if I doubt Las Vegas leadership’s strategic competence as regards maintaining their city as a global tourist destination. In addition,
> a tourist-driven revenue model
You do understand that this “tourist-driven revenue model” has to fill up multiple weekday games, with one of the consistently worst teams in the league, that has detonated its entire fanbase. Most likely scenario here is a lot of those tickets get sold off in bulk as casino comps, and very likely unused. This will be an even worse look than the Raiders’ stadium consistently filling up with the other team’s fans. If, at this late date, you don’t understand that baseball is the major sport most dependent on local revenue and a strong local fanbase, I don’t know what to tell you.
> it suggests the major fault for the team not securing a stadium deal in the Bay Area was John Fisher’s.
Yes, actually, it was; and any claim to the contrary comes from temporarily embarrassed millionaires like yourself tacitly assuming that anyone with more money than you must somehow be smarter than you. At any time in the last 20 years, he could have simply redeveloped on the Coliseum site, which already has excellent transit accessibility, far superior to the Giants stadium across the Bay. The Giants are really only easily capable of serving local residents and people coming up the peninsula on Caltrain. Getting to their stadium is remarkably inconvenient for anyone else in the broader region, especially the East Bay diaspora who moved out to the rapidly-growing exurbs over the past 30 years. John Fisher was in a perfect position to capitalize on this with the existing stadium site, yet utterly failed throughout his tenure.
And you do understand that he wanted to own the Coliseum site, right? Albeit to repurpose into a housing/commercial development, because his last best idea was to ape the Giants by building a ridiculously inaccessible waterfront ballpark next to Jack London Square. Thus giving up his main competitive advantage against the Giants. If you’re going to have to hoof it multiple blocks from a train station to a ballpark, why not stay on the BART train another 15 minutes and go see the team that’s actually won multiple World Series this century?
It was quite the opposite of bad politics, and it wasn’t environmental red tape. It was the city of Oakland making a wise decision (for once) that they did not want to be in business with John Fisher as one of their biggest landowners and developers, given his existing track record of neglect. You weren’t here, you don’t understand, your analysis is invalid. But Las Vegas is happy to do business (at least for a while) with anyone who shows up waving around promissory notes, so good luck with all that.
My analysis is perfectly valid. Enjoyed your snide grammar reference. I won’t respond to your points. I understand the poor stadium attendance over most of their nearly 60 years in Oakland. You have also implied your particular politics, and I don’t want to waste any time with that
I don’t think you understand the Las Vegas market at all. It’s the most cutthroat live entertainment market in the world. The A’s are an unserious organization run by a fail son with no relevant business success of his own.
An interesting problem with the A’s. When they come to Vegas the current structure of MLB.tv means the dodgers will be out of market which means all the Dodger fans there ( and it’s very much a Dodger town) can watch the Dodgers much easier/cheaper. People will not be adopting the A’s as a “second team”. The mere presence of the A’s in the market means the average Las Vegas baseball fan will have easier access to watch their favorite team. The A’s have no star power and never will under current ownership.
It is quite amusing to read someone telling me I don’t understand the Las Vegas market at all. Your comments suggest you are from Northern California.
Regarding the entertainment market, heads of major hotels/casinos/resorts are welcoming the A’s, have already promoted them, and from their comments, that will continue. The MGM CEO next to the ballpark has gone on record several times. The Circa owner has as well, advertising at the Sacramento ballpark and hosting a watch party last season at his resort.
Regarding fan support, you are correct; many are Dodger fans, including myself. But you and many in Northern California totally fail to understand is that you can be a fan of two teams, especially in different leagues. In fact, during the latter part of last season, many of us actually found the A’s more fun to watch with a young core of enthusiastic players.
You missed the boat again about the Dodgers being easier to watch once the A’s arrive. Clark County Nevada is already in the home market of Spectrum Sports LA, the Dodger RSN. The Dodgers are already easy to watch without blackout restrictions. That could change, but as of now, many viewers without paying for MLB or ESPN can watch all the Dodgers and A’s regular season games.
As far as fan support, there are already Las Vegas-based social media groups for the A’s, close to 5,000 already and growing daily. Another sports related group close to 11,000, so I have a pretty good pulse on the growing fan support. Local stores are selling more A’s gear and they say it’s hard to keep items in stock. The team is actively supporting Little League, building community and fan support.
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I don’t post much in hostile venues, so I probably won’t post much here further. I don’t really care about what outsiders think, but I responded as I enjoyed the debates. The Fisher family has the wealth. Minority local investors are mostly an MLB desire to strengthen local ties. Smart money continues to invest in the area. We will be fine.
John F doesn’t understand to most people baseball’s product is being able to go to a fun social event and enjoy nice summer weather. The Vegas A’s cannot offer that. Baseball’s ancillary product to most people is exciting games, that people watch on television- the John Fisher A’s do not offer that.
They really offer nothing people want to see. A mediocre at best team playing indoors is not a draw in the entertainment capitol of the world.
I am not a northern Californian, never have been. I can just see someone selling BS and am happy to call it out.
Your blurb is not worth a reply, but in brief: Your opinion that “nice summer weather” is a requirement to enjoy baseball is disputed by many in Las Vegas, especially when the games will be played in an air-conditioned stadium.
Your opinion that indoor baseball is not a draw is also disputed by attendance in a number of indoor stadiums.
Your predicting the team will be “mediocre at best” is disupted by many experts who have seen the player moves during the past year.
Your opinions are clearly irrelevant to those of us in Las Vegas. But it doesn’t matter; you’ve been wrong about points in your previous comments.
Please show me the wonderful attendance numbers of MLB teams playing indoors.
BOT.
And it posted it’s inane drivel in the wrong thread.
If Vegas is such a great baseball market then why didn’t MLB slap Fisher with a relocation fee. The Raiders had to pay one when they moved to Vegas. The NHL was in a desperate situation with the Coyotes and was still able to extract relo money from the new Utah owners.
sorry to come late to the conversation… one comment was locals in Fremont, California were vociferous against building stadium down the street. This is very true! Lou Wolfe the previous minority owner of A’s was shocked at that response. But should he be? Who wants 6000 cars driving 12,000 people in front of their porch 80 games a year?? (12k in attendees is me being nice, more likely less. ) More importantly, Lou left, and Fisher has yet to find a comparable partner replacement despite all the smiles from Kaval before he got fired. The new minority owners are smaller and attach conditions, in the case Aramark. Why is that? well it’s a question of trust and investors don’t see ROI. what they’re getting is an overpriced team, sold by a guy who has always underpaid his team. Peace.